Amish made hardwood

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:39 pm 
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Buck wrote:
Hey,

I do water damage restoration and would agree that you should not install the hardwood under cabinets. It just doesn't make any sense to spend the additional money on flooring you'll never see. And as stated before it makes drying alot harder and expensive.


How does this effect the height of the dishwasher & range? What are they going to sit on?

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:42 pm 
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Barquios wrote:
Cabinets installed on top of a floating floor need to be shimmed up so that they do not sit on the floor. If you shim them up 1/4" higher than the thickness of the floor, you will allow the floating floor system to still function as it is designed and not void any warrantees.


What if you're gluing engineered wood flooring?

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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 10:54 pm 
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Location: Larry S. Cherry 4590 Ash Street Plano, TX 75024
Our cabinet installers have been telling us that we may have a problem because installing the cabinetry over hardwood is not a good idea - the cabinets will become unaligned with the shifting of the wood and our granite will probably crack and break.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:08 am 
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Cabinets installed on top of a floating floor need to be shimmed up so that they do not sit on the floor.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2015 12:53 am 
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The European cabinet bases which have screw type adjusters and a large plastic base sit on a floating floor without causing a problem. The cabinets are not wide and with adjusters in the four corners the weight is spread out. When a row of the cabinets are fastened together they all can sink in a tiny bit when the foam bottoms out over time.
I have heard that entire floor may be taken up when moving out of a house. The cabinets can also be carried to the next home, too. Just the sink stays!
Houses don't change hands very often, but I've heard this is the tradition.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 6:55 am 
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Location: Al Sufouh 1,Dubai,United Arab Emirates
I believe the kitchen installs is where the debate mainly is because of the water issue. if not, it probably makes sense to floor in the cabinets. :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 9:57 pm 
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Floors put in after the cabinets will not affect the cabinet from water being drawn by capillary action under the cabinets, which can swell the wood and with enough pressure created disturb the counter tops. If the floor gets flooded and seeps under the cabinets with no flooring under then the sub-floor will have a decent chance of drying out without causing mold problems from staying wet for a longer
period of time.
If the floors do get flooded and the counter tops are disturbed by swelled flooring this will probably be covered by homeowners fire insurance. It will be a much bigger job to get back into the kitchen, or other rooms where the floor has been flooded because of more than only floor repair from the flood.
If your floor does get flooded, call your fire department for help. They have equipment to get water out of the house after a fire, if it will help.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:38 pm 
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Toe kicks at 4" for a reason. To get your feet under it. Installing the floor afterwards makes it 3.25 if you are using. 3/4 floor

Duh, what about the dishwasher??? Would be hard to get in or out with subfloor ....


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:16 am 
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I only install strips on the edges of the dishwasher cabinet so the feet can slide in.
It must be kept at the height of the adjacent flooring so it can be slipped out with no obstruction.
There is construction water-proof paper under the wood strips which helps to keep drafts from coming up through the sub-floor, unless it is plywood. If there is a leak the wood won't be as much of a problem as a complete floor under it which could buckle and keep the dishwasher from being removed.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:55 am 
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I've read about this and it seems you can go either way except is some cases.

Installing the floor first:
Heavy cabinets can interfere with the floor expanding and contracting
You wouldn't want to put cabinets on engineered 5/8 or less wood, doesn't support it well
If you had to replace portions of the floor later you would have to remove the cabinets /counter top- if you had a big island this would be a major issue
Creates a problem if dishwasher leaked as stated above


Cabinets first
For remodeling you can maintain an operable kitchen for the most part during construction
You would need to install the cabinets on strips to bring the cabinet height to correct specs for 36" countertop
I guess if you had adjustable legs and 4.5" toe kick this wouldn't be an issue
Easier to remove floor later
Gives floor room to expand


Tommy from This Old House suggest installing cabinet first but installing them on a strip, there is an article on TOH website


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 9:11 am 
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Gary wrote:
Bottom line, it's a waste of time dealing with explaining WHY you charge what you charge. Simply say , "This is what it costs to do the job correctly." Who are they to argue? Are they the flooring experts? Who has the license and the credentials? I tell my builders the correct way to do the job from the git-go. If they are not interested in doing it correctly, then they sign a waiver. And they rarely wish to do that so most of the time they relent and meet my recommendations based on each job. I walk the job, make notes and take measurements and readings and present to them a recommendation, based on the job and the clients wishes. They can decide whatever they want. I do not waste my time dealing with penny-pinchers or control freaks. Bottom line, I am the expert and I know my craft and product better than any builder. So it is I who determines how and when the flooring is installed. There is no negotiation in this regard but I do try to be flexible and accomodating without sacrificing quality.



It's not really about that. The problem is that customers don't understand how the material is purchased. Typically you will buy x sq ft to do the job, end is story. They bought whether it's under the cabinet or a small pile of left over scraps sits in the garage after the job is done.

Carpet comes in one width, you have to buy x feet by the width of the roll regardless what you use. Same concept.

It's not about arguing with the customer it's about explaining to them. If you told me that "that's what it costs to do the job correctly" you'd be fired and I'll be looking for another contractor. Because you came off as a jerk and poor customer service. Not you personally but I'm just saying to make my point here!

But the way you describe your method doesn't come off as friendly. After all the customer is paying you to work, not the other way around.

Ever read that Gaundie quote about the customer ?


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 Post subject: Re: What goes first
PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 9:23 am 
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mrafalek wrote:
Don't install the floor under the cabinets this is the right way.
Depending on the project people decide to do differently and it might work as well. If the clients doesn have a general contractor she or him will listen to whomever is more perswaiding. Floor guy :"hey it will be very much cheaper if I do it before" For a floor contractor it is really easier. You don't have to glue it under the cabinets, you don't have to nail i, and sanding under the cabinnets to do the great job takes time.So if there is client that wants to safe as much money as spossible then yes he will listen to floor guy.
Cabinet maker: " This will cost you extra to protect the floor "
So it all depends on the budget of the client and planning, sometimes saving money makes you pay for it in the future.

I have done high end unfinished project where we have installed the floor first sanded and finished it with two coats of finish and after a month or two contractor called me up to screen and apply last coat .

Prefinished can very well be installed after the cabinets I think.



I don't see how allowing this as an option for the customer to save money. In a new house built in a subdivision managed by a builder, the customer doesn't get to make a lot of these types of detailed decisions. In their house plan they choose hardwood floors, that's what they get. Now in a scenario where someone is building a custom home and maybe it's them working with the contractors, they can make these choices but here's where I get lost in your post. If I walk into an empty rooom like a kitchen ready to measure the sq footage, I'm won't be measuring then subtracting the space where the cabinets sit. I mean if the room is 20x15, then I'll order 300 sq ft plus 10% waste.

also flooring normally comes in bundles and you need to order in 20 sq ft increments.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:05 am 
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That's really a good question. I too used to have the same doubt, but that was clarified as after cabinets is the perfect option for a long run.


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:04 am 
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after reading the reply still no one answer the question..


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 Post subject: Re: Hardwood Floor Before or After Kitchen Cabinets?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:50 pm 
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The consensus is after the cabinets.


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